Hello all new to the list,
I just wan't to comment on a number of complaints about the "needed membership" to write to the mailing list "x2go-dev". At the moment you can only write to the list, after you've registered your email address. This is done, because if everybody can write to the list we would receive a lot of spam. I have to delete really a lot of "non accepted/hold" messages per day which are normally spam only. I can understand, that not everybody wants to register to such a service promote the service of gmane (making a list look like a forum).
Heinz
On Mon, 2010-06-28 at 21:37 +0200, Heinz-M. Graesing wrote:
Hello all new to the list,
I just wan't to comment on a number of complaints about the "needed membership" to write to the mailing list "x2go-dev". At the moment you can only write to the list, after you've registered your email address. This is done, because if everybody can write to the list we would receive a lot of spam. I have to delete really a lot of "non accepted/hold" messages per day which are normally spam only. I can understand, that not everybody wants to register to such a service promote the service of gmane (making a list look like a forum).
- but the very popular alternative "forum" needs registration too. I need to write about this issue, because there are complaints about the level which must be taken to send informations to our project/community. I'll describe how to handle the list in our new wiki, and I'll definitly
<snip> No complaints here; I really appreciate the SPAM free list - John
Dear Heinz,
Am Montag, den 28.06.2010, 21:37 +0200 schrieb Heinz-M. Graesing:
Hello all new to the list,
I just wan't to comment on a number of complaints about the "needed membership" to write to the mailing list "x2go-dev". At the moment you can only write to the list, after you've registered your email address. This is done, because if everybody can write to the list we would receive a lot of spam. I have to delete really a lot of "non accepted/hold" messages per day which are normally spam only.
how is Mailman set up currently at BerliOS? Do messages get moderated or rejected? Guessing from your statement I would say moderated. Can you change that to rejection by default [3]. Then people get told right away, that they need to subscribe. Please also add
»You need to subscribe to post to the list. Otherwise your
message will be rejected automatically.«
or
»Posting Note: as an anti-spam measure, posts from
non-subscribers will be automatically rejected; you can
subscribe and turn off mail delivery if you prefer to read list
traffic some other way. First-time posters' messages will be
moderated« [2]
to [1] to make this clear to people.
I can understand, that not everybody wants to register to such a service promote the service of gmane (making a list look like a forum).
- but the very popular alternative "forum" needs registration too. I need to write about this issue, because there are complaints about the level which must be taken to send informations to our project/community. I'll describe how to handle the list in our new wiki, and I'll definitly
describing this in the Wiki is a great idea. Of course a link on [1] to the Wiki page is also an option.
Thanks,
Paul
[1] https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/x2go-dev [2] http://lists.boost.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/boost [3] http://nbcs.rutgers.edu/mailman/newlist.shtml
Dear list, dear future list members (for the gmane archive readers),
On Mo 28 Jun 2010 21:37:55 CEST "Heinz-M. Graesing" wrote:
Hello all new to the list,
I just wan't to comment on a number of complaints about the "needed membership" to write to the mailing list "x2go-dev". At the moment you can only write to the list, after you've registered your email address. This is done, because if everybody can write to the list we would receive a lot of spam. I have to delete really a lot of "non accepted/hold" messages per day which are normally spam only. I can understand, that not everybody wants to register to such a service promote the service of gmane (making a list look like a forum).
- but the very popular alternative "forum" needs registration too. I need to write about this issue, because there are complaints about the level which must be taken to send informations to our project/community. I'll describe how to handle the list in our new wiki, and I'll definitly
a mailing list is one of _the_ communication facilities in opensource
software projects and cooperative projects in general.
There is really no need to complain about these facilities. There is
only a need to get involved.
For busy people (like software developers) the main aspect of
utilizing mailing lists is that communicees from all different kinds
of projects a developer is involved in flow together in one single
mailbox. Opposed to logging into 27 forums twice a day (at least) you
can have all the communication at a single glance.
But... Using mailing lists without mail filtering can be a nuissance,
though indeed. Thus, if you register for a mailing list like x2go-dev
please make sure that you use a mail client like Thunderbird, Horde
Webmail etc. that supports genuine mail filtering methods. You
certainly do not want to have mailing list postings jamming your
INBOX...
Mails having passed the x2go-dev list can be recognized by the mail
header line:
List-Id: <x2go-dev.lists.berlios.de>
A mail filter can identify mails containing this line and store/move
all mails that apply to the filter rule into a separate folder. Once
you have configured this, all x2go-dev mails end up in this one
dedicated subfolder in your mailbox. You can even (depending on your
mail client) display the received postings in ,,thread view'' (i.e.
sorted by flow of the discussion).
I am pretty new to the list and have only recently got to know the
x2go project... However, believe me, there is no need to complain
about anything. As users of opensource software it is our job to
support the development of the software code and ease the developers'
days. So please, take this responsibility!
Consumption (and complaining) takes place in another world...
Just my 10¢... Mike
--
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On 28 June 2010 21:37, Heinz-M. Graesing <x2go-dev@x2go.org> wrote:
[snip]
This is done, because if everybody can write to the list we would receive a lot of spam. I have to delete really a lot of "non accepted/hold" messages per day which are normally spam only. [snip]
The more of these mundane tasks we can remove from the developers shoulders, the better. I'm sure everyone will agree on this. I hope you're not shy about telling us if there is anything we can do to help make communications and such run smoothly, and without interfering too much with the actual development.
How do you feel about Launchpad.net? Much of the traffic on this list consists of questions or bug reports. By using LP, we could collect questions and answers, so that we can just copy and paste a link to the answer when questions are asked several times. The same goes for bug reports, of course, and it handles translations, blueprints and code as well. Yes, users will still have to register, but launchpad will take care of that.
It seems to me that by opening up a little more, the number of bug reports and questions might increase, but it'll be easier to distribute the load as well. I also think it's important to have a highly visible bug tracker so that testers can help confirm which bugs are reproducible, and if they're not, possibly discern the circumstances required to do so.
Thanks,
Jo-Erlend Schinstad
On Di 29 Jun 2010 00:03:58 CEST Jo-Erlend Schinstad wrote:
On 28 June 2010 21:37, Heinz-M. Graesing <x2go-dev@x2go.org> wrote:
[snip]
This is done, because if everybody can write to the list we would receive a lot of spam. I have to delete really a lot of "non accepted/hold" messages per day which are normally spam only. [snip]
The more of these mundane tasks we can remove from the developers shoulders, the better. I'm sure everyone will agree on this. I hope you're not shy about telling us if there is anything we can do to help make communications and such run smoothly, and without interfering too much with the actual development.
How do you feel about Launchpad.net? Much of the traffic on this list consists of questions or bug reports. By using LP, we could collect questions and answers, so that we can just copy and paste a link to the answer when questions are asked several times. The same goes for bug reports, of course, and it handles translations, blueprints and code as well. Yes, users will still have to register, but launchpad will take care of that.
It seems to me that by opening up a little more, the number of bug reports and questions might increase, but it'll be easier to distribute the load as well. I also think it's important to have a highly visible bug tracker so that testers can help confirm which bugs are reproducible, and if they're not, possibly discern the circumstances required to do so.
Thanks,
Jo-Erlend Schinstad
+1 from me on this...
Mike
--
DAS-NETZWERKTEAM mike gabriel, dorfstr. 27, 24245 barmissen fon: +49 (4302) 281418, fax: +49 (4302) 281419
eMail-LeseSchreibStunde: wochentags 8h-10h mail: m.gabriel@das-netzwerkteam.de, http://das-netzwerkteam.de
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Am 28.06.2010 21:37, schrieb Heinz-M. Graesing:
Hello all new to the list,
funny to quote myself...
...I didn't want to complain about the list itself. There are some people that don't want to be member of the list, but contacting me on all the topics on the list. So communication by the list is exacly what we wan't and what is a very good proof of concept. Some day between some releases we'll move the list to our own server so that we have more control about the preferences. There were some very nice discussions about that topic on linuxtag, even with some really good software advice. Again thank you for your ideas and help.
best regards,
Heinz
Dear Heinz,
On Di 29 Jun 2010 07:28:33 CEST "Heinz-M. Graesing" wrote:
...I didn't want to complain about the list itself. There are some people that don't want to be member of the list, but contacting me on all the topics on the list. So communication by the list is exacly what we wan't and what is a very good proof of concept.
:-)
Some day between some releases we'll move the list to our own server so that we have more control about the preferences. There were some very nice discussions about that topic on linuxtag, even with some really good software advice.
Again, what some people here are trying to say: delegate this work to
someone else, e.g. someone listening to these postings.
For example:
(a)
I have a production mail system up and running, including a well
configured mailman. Just drop a note...
(b)
If you prefer having a mailman server in your domain, setup a VM and
give me ssh access (with sudo capabilities) to it. I will set it up
for you... (it will need some aliasing etc. on your main mail machine,
though. But, just say, please do it.
Again thank you for your ideas and help
Welcome, Mike
--
DAS-NETZWERKTEAM mike gabriel, dorfstr. 27, 24245 barmissen fon: +49 (4302) 281418, fax: +49 (4302) 281419
eMail-LeseSchreibStunde: wochentags 8h-10h mail: m.gabriel@das-netzwerkteam.de, http://das-netzwerkteam.de
freeBusy: https://mail.das-netzwerkteam.de/freebusy/m.gabriel%40das-netzwerkteam.de.xf...
Heinz-M. Graesing schreef:
Hello all new to the list,
I just wan't to comment on a number of complaints about the "needed membership" to write to the mailing list "x2go-dev". At the moment you can only write to the list, after you've registered your email address.
That's really normal for open source projects!
This is done, because if everybody can write to the list we would receive a lot of spam. I have to delete really a lot of "non accepted/hold" messages per day which are normally spam only. I can understand, that not everybody wants to register to such a service
- but the very popular alternative "forum" needs registration too. I need to write about this issue, because there are complaints about the level which must be taken to send informations to our project/community.
I am interested what kind of people complain, I don't think this are people who are in open source projects.
I'll describe how to handle the list in our new wiki,
I don't think this is important. We need experienced people, not the aboslute beginners.
and I'll definitly promote the service of gmane (making a list look like a forum).
Mailinglist: http://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/x2go-dev Forum: http://news.gmane.org/gmane.linux.terminal-server.x2go.devel Usenet: gmane.linux.terminal-server.x2go.devel on news.gmane.org
I would remove the webform, and be a bit "harder" to people who contact you directly. Don't answer when it's not about security related bugs or consultancy. You don't have the time!
With regards, Paul van der Vlis.